Thursday, November 30, 2006
Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 10:45:03 AM (Mountain Standard Time, UTC-07:00)  Comments [4] | 
Categories: ArcGIS Server | Blogging | ESRI

I just gave Steve's post about how ESRI's fleeting movement towards community based, open communication seems to have been quashed by a segment of the organization who are wed to 90's communication paradigms - slick marketing, throw sheets, and a tall shiny enterprise facade with nary a human in sight.

It is an interesting post, and although I've never been on the "inside", the people I know at ESRI are all fantastic and very dedicated to building great software and systems. This is what makes ESRI more than the sum of it's software. Yet this is sorely lacking in their communication strategy. So, being on the outside, the thing that comes to my mind is that there must be some layer in ESRI which is just not "getting" the whole open discussion = better control of the message. Since Jack seems to have

As Steve notes, open communications can also head off heated threads...

There was not one official word from ESRI anywhere clarifying this new stance on licensing. There was a heated thread going on and we all know that the ESRI folks read blog threads. We never see them officially answer anything there but from my logs and discussions with others, I know they read those kind of threads. Even if they don’t respond on the thread there should be somewhere they can address this issue in a formal manner. There was enough heat there to deserve a little bit of light.

While it's a small step, David Maguire's blog is just too "happy+shiny" to be taken as much more than repackaged marketing. For more on what it takes to have a good "CEO" blog (or any blog for that matter), check Seth Godin's free e-book 'Who's There?' 

Anyhow - to the point of the post - in the comments on Steve's post, Sean Gilles noted that someone posted to the OpenLayers mailing list re: an ArcGIS Server connector. A little digging on at OpenLayers.org, and here's the posting...

I'm working toward creating a layer class for the ArcGIS Server 9.1
MapServer Object web service.  So far I've created the AGS layer class by
extending OpenLayers.Layer.Grid and it seemed that I also needed to create
an AGS tile class by extending OpenLayers.Tile.Image. [continues...]

-- Brian Hatchl on OpenLayers "Dev" Mailing List Nov 29,2006
 

A Call to Action!
If everyone who does not like the ADF licensing model simply contributed 8 hours to this effort, we could have a free, robust, open, alternative that would address the needs of many many organizations. I mean - if I want to edit versioned vector data in a browser, then sure, I'll pay for the ADF because that's the powerful part of it's power. But if I just want to server up a simple map, with simple functions, then OpenLayers would be just fine. Just look at how many mashups were created wit GoogleMaps - clearly pushpins and seamless panning can cover a lot of use cases!  

Anyhow - looks like it's time to signup for the OpenLayers "Dev" list and dust off my Javascript! 

Thursday, November 30, 2006 11:59:10 AM (Mountain Standard Time, UTC-07:00)
The WSDL changes between 9.1 and 9.2 so they are not fully compatible. Web services is definetly the way to interact with ArcGIS but I think it is better baked in 9.2. As I noted in the thread on ADF licensing, both ADFs use web services by default to talk to ArcGIS Server. There are significant speed advantages and there is no need for interops since it is just a plain old web service. I can contribute some to the effort but given my history I don't want to taint the code. Dave give me a ping if you want me to help out.
Thursday, November 30, 2006 3:48:43 PM (Mountain Standard Time, UTC-07:00)
Dave,

Good call!

Bruce
Bruce Bannerman
Thursday, November 30, 2006 4:37:03 PM (Mountain Standard Time, UTC-07:00)
I'd like to hear more from Steven about the "native" web service of ArcGIS Server. I'm not really doing this because of licensing model concerns with the AGS ADF, but...
The OpenLayers AGS MapServer Object class I'm working on talks to a web service implemented with the AGS Java ADF. It's the Web Service Catalog template actually. Is there a "native" Map Server object web service that I could use, without installing the ADF?

My attraction to OpenLayers is that the client can pull data from distributed network resources for it's basemaps and overlays through lots of different supported interfaces. The AGS ADF web controls seem like they are intended to build a client that's tightly coupled to a single AGS instance (e.g. one map control -> one map document data frame). For distributed data sources, that map doc data frame would have to pull all the layers together on the server. Not very efficient if there's one slow data source in the layer list.
Brian Hatchl
Thursday, November 30, 2006 11:18:08 PM (Mountain Standard Time, UTC-07:00)
Yeah Brian the MapServer object can be published as a web service, and if I recall properly, by default they are published as web services. This means you can now send WSDL back and forth to the server object. The problem is that it has been about 6 months since I have done any of the web services work. I don't remember if you can send the SOAP over HTTP or if the server is going to expect if over DCOM. Either way, there is a native mapserver wsdl that you can use to communicate with the server directly and bypass the ADF.

You have to give me some more time to think about it and see if I can dig up some old samples. I don't want to steer your down the wrong path.

Here is a sample where they write a SWING app to talk to AGS MapServer Web Service
http://edndoc.esri.com/arcobjects/9.2/Java/java/server/quickstarts/EclipseServer.html#wsp

I wish I had an EDN subscription, then I could dig in some more....
Let me know if you have other questions. Feel free to contact me @ scitronpousty gmail
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